Injection machines and molds

[Delw]

I've had alot of interest in this over the last year or so.

Currently I am working on a CNC style inject machine for a customer. This one is pretty complexed and pricey.

There are other ways that are alot cheaper and more simple. I have had some discussion with 2 companies in the last year one just today thats sounds very promising.( we are probally going to use this product on the 5 color machine)

These would produce med to high quanities at a low cost,you can use the same 2 piece molds that we sell now , or we can build different molds to shoot multiple colors in one bait.

I guess what I am asking is if there is any other interest from anyone ?

Delw

[Delw]

Oh yeah forgot to say. this will open the possibilities(sp) for a whole different type of baits avail to people with a small lure making business

Delw

[millsryno]

Del, I would be very interested depending on price. I have researched a couple machines and found prices in the $15K+ range and gave up.

[fish2win]

I watch this forum alot but never registered until I saw this post. Very inerested, but price will be an factor. Been kicking it around for some time now. Keep us informed!

[Delw]

there under 5k . I will keep you informed as things progress, it will be a week or so anyhow.

Delw

[GregColeParker]

Del, do you have any pictures of the progress of the machine? I would be interested in seeing it.

[millsryno]

Del,

Aprox. how many molds will be required for each machine and how many baits can it produce per hour? What is the size of the machine? Any pictures or other info would be great.

Ryan

[rxfish]

Put me on the list as well. The last quote I got was out of L.A. and it was 65K. The whole thing sat on a base no bigger than a picnic table and on the order of the stuff used by Roboworms. I'm all for it but can't hock the house to get one.

[Delw]

When I get the cnc machine working I will post some pics. like I said that one is expensive. as soon as I get more info about the others I will post the pics as well.
The guy I talked to today really perked my interest.


Delw

[Delw]

Rx, robos machines(type) are cake to make and they can be made for about 15k for a 5 color machine (probally alot less). these are not injection machines, but more of a automated hand pouring machine, since they use one sided molds( have a flat spot).
The price goes up about 2-3k per color for that type of machine.
There machines are very simple in design.

Delw

[Delw]

Ryan

for the robo type machine you would need about 30 one cavity molds to do it right and get the most production out of it.

on the ones for like stick baits and the rest of our 2 piece molds anywhere from 7-10 should do ok 10-20 and you could haul butt if you have someone to take the out and put the molds back together.

However that being said you can run high production on stik molds with 15+ molds and a large pouring pot from stay warm. I am thinking like 5k-10k a week , I heard guys getting 20k plus a week with 3 guys and lots of molds.

Delw

[wickedbass.com]

Del, Id be interested also .. i also have been looking into them as well. Let me know a little more info on the machine when you get it ...any pics would be great.

[ghostbaits]

I have looked at several recently. Several range from just about 3K to 5K and then you jump to the big prices.

I have been told by some that have seen these less expensive versions that they actually can be made from around $800 - $1000. Molds are extra if you don't have them but these less expensive models also allow for hand pouring as well.

I personally know a guy that has 2. He does both hand pours and injection baits now. There is even the option for swirled baits (ie Tiki sticks).

I see a lot of guys going this way which is great as hand pours will become more sought after when most jump ship to injection...

I might be interested Del if your model will do the hand pours as I'm not that interested in injection baits.

Jim

[HOOKED_UP]

hey everyone del i am very intrested in the injection mold machine when you have time i would love to hear more about it .... and also about the two piece worm molds mark me down for a 7 inch curl tail :) oh boy am i hooked

[iangler]

I too would be very interested in this. Please keep us posted.

[cobra bait]

i have been looking around and am interested as well.

[garrett]

i didnt see any worms that i would like so could i send you a worm in the mail and you can make it?

[Delw]

Garret you can, some I have already programmed but havnent had time to run them I am way way behind on custom molds expect a 6 month lead time( some are easier and they get done much faster)

Delw

[jamesdenson]

just starting out in this but if i see a way to make a profit doing this i will buy what ever needed to do so so i am very interested ty also want a 7.5 inch u tale worm mold plz

[cwenbass]

What does an injection machine do?

[Delw]

An inject machine will shoot plastic into a mold that wont fill up by hand pouring ( ie gravity) its nice for curltails and molds with small appendages.



Delw

[aaafish@earthlink.net]

Hey Del,
What's the latest on this?

[rippin lips lures]

Any more info update ?I am also intrested.

[Delw]

On the CNC type injector? NO
if someone had 20-30k to spend I would consider picking back up were I left off.

there are other injectors that you could get am make for under 400 bucks.

[Fisher_of_One]

Hey Del, DO you have intructions or know a site that can assist me in making this under $400 injection machine. I am not looking for a huge production output just want the ability to better fill 2 part molds with hard to fill areas.

[Delw]

Yeah , I can help you out.
There is another post on it somewhere, its very simple.

Delw

[Delw]

http://www.del-mart.com/forum/showthread.php?t=131

that link should do it, its also a sticky in this forum

[rxfish]

Del you mentioned one time the setup Robo uses is fairly simple. Could shed any light on this process and startup cost. I know they have upgraded their machines as was stated in an issue of Bass West Magazine, but more interested in the way they got started.

[mrrgeorge]

Someone said ther was an injection machine for $400. Who makes this?
I've checked the market and the cheapest 2 1/2 gallon one is around $2000.
I've made one for myself for around $800 and have been pouring approximately 1000 a day, 5" type worm using 2 book molds with 8 cavities each.

[Delw]

You have to make it,.
you cannot buy it, ones that are close to the same to the one I posted about cost about 3,500-5k

all it is a prestone pressure cooker and some minor modifications

[Riverrat]

I understand the injector and how it helps on the tails and hard to pour items, but every one says its pressurized. I'm interested does it seal to the mold at all or does it just pour out of the ball valve? Can it squirt out the sides when you fill the mold? I hope my question is clear.

Riverrat
Rip their lips off!!!

[Delw]

Generally your using from 2-5lbs of pressure, most guys hold it up to the spout and shoot it.

if you take a rubber air hose adapter it will go right up to your mold and seal it.

another way is to fix your pressure pot to a table then below it have some springs that will hold the mold to the spout. push the mold down to move to the next cavity or change the mold.
If you need a pic I can sketch something up so you get the idea.

with 2-5 lbs of pressure it wont squirt the plastic out the sides.

Some common sence must be used as your playing with hot plastic.

Delw

[Jeff]

Yes. Yes. Yes

[Talknbass]

I'm interested in more information about these machines. Keep me posted too!

[bernerbass99]

I would be intrested but i dont have the money right now because i'm a college student but in the future it would be a sure thing

[rockylinx]

would a wax injector work the same as the pressure pots and plastic injectors

[bassnfool]

A wax injector won't get up to the temperatures you'll need.

[pressley]

del
I've been hand pouring for a little while. two of your molds and some I made. Now I want to grow so I looked at zorn injection press. I loved it but 32k wow the one I looked at could do about 18k worms in 10 hours. Do you know of another press about half of price? Maybe half production? Oh yeah the molds for that press were 5k.

[Delw]

del
I've been hand pouring for a little while. two of your molds and some I made. Now I want to grow so I looked at zorn injection press. I loved it but 32k wow the one I looked at could do about 18k worms in 10 hours. Do you know of another press about half of price? Maybe half production? Oh yeah the molds for that press were 5k.


you will never find a press type injection machine for half or even close.
While that zorn injection machine is expensive its well worth the money and will pay for itself pretty quickly.

The molds are also water cooled and have many cavities. 5k isnt a bad price either.

you can make a semi manual type injection machine or buy one already made for under 5k, however you will need to buy lots of molds to feed it and keep it going while they are cooling off. you would probally be able to do 4-10 cavities at one time , some baits you can do more.

your out put wouldnt be close to what the zorn machine would be , your expense would be less and your labor involved would be alot more than a zorn machine.

bottom line it all depends on how big you want to go and how much work you want to do, guys can hand pour thousands of baits a day ( single color stuff) with the proper set-up.

if you need to make 50-100 baits every couple of mins your going to have to go with a zorn machine.

The other thing to look at is, if your not mechanically inclined your going to need support for that machine and zorn has some pretty good support.
if your not mechanically inclined makeing your own machine would cost you quite a bit in outside process's and might not be worth it in the long run.

If I remember correctly Zorn also sells a smaller machine for half the price while its limited to 1 color I think it might be something to consider.?

Delw

[pressley]

Del
Thanks for the advice.I thought about the 1 color but if I'm going to drop that kind of money whats 7k more.I'm not worried about operating the press my concern was If there was any other machines for better price. But if you say there isn't you should know.Do you think you could make the molds for the press?Also can the plastic you sell be used.? What is the price of 55 gallons?Sorry about all the questions.

[Delw]

Oh I know what you mean, about the difference. its like ok I am starting out with 25k but with this option I can do this and its 7k, then wait theres another option that I would really like to have and its 10k, but getting these 2 options I need to get this so thats another 10k and it keeps going.
Just like machines the base price of one is around 100k, but by the time you add in all the nice options you add another 50k, then you need to buy tooling and wow theres another 50k easy.

I honestly don't know of any like the zorn machines, some people have built there own using zorn parts heat exchangers etc...

Yes we could build you a mold for that machine no problem.
but some things you need to keep in mind.

with out prints I would need to see the mold , could be a major shipping cost.
I would have to reverse engineer it for all the location holes and water lines and such, its no problem to do however it just takes time which ='s money
if you could get them to send you a blank mold minus the cavities thats a good possibility.
There molds and machines are proprietary so I am betting they wont send you prints.
then you have the cutting cost, programming cost and set-up cost. I am betting I will be real close to zorn if not more.
Sometimes it might be best to go with the manufacture.
we could always look into it if you need us too.

Calhoun runs through a lot of zorn machines
call me for the plastic pricing I will give you a number to call and a Name.

[rusty3]

I have only been pouring about 3 months with a Lee plastic pot & some silicone molds, but I'm ready to move to some good aluminum molds. I also have been thinking about a small injection rig. I saw one on another web site for about $2000. it looked like a pressure cooker like you use in the kitchen. I Was thinking about making one but don't have the time. I would be very intrested in one in this price range.

[rusty3]

I would be very intrested in one priced about $1500 to $2000

[Delw]

Rusty
Our molds dont take injection machines and quite honestly an injection machine would be a waste for the hand pour molds we make.
I won't make an injection machine for public sale even out of a pressure pot too much of a libility.

Remember with an injection machine even a small one like you described you will need lots of molds to keep the machine going. that add's into the 3-6k range easy just for molds

[rusty3]

What are you guys using to pour ? I have problems with the (Lee Production Pot IV) I am using it doesn't keep temperature. I will be pouring and the plastic will start to thicken and stop running as I look at my thermoneter in the pot temp is down to about 260 or 280 from 350 wen I started pouring. Also I can't pour 2-pice molds do to the 4" hight of the spout.

[Basseducer]

rusty3,
You can reverse the base and put your pot on blocks or whatever you have to elevate it, be sure to anchor the base so it doesn't tip. You can also look into a presto pot, while it isn't a pressure pot it will certainly increase your volume, and you can still use your flat molds and 2 piece as well. Here is a link, Mike is a really great guy and easy to deal with. Cost is only 2-3 hundred bucks. Good luck.

TJ

[Chadk]

What are you guys using to pour ? I have problems with the (Lee Production Pot IV) I am using it doesn't keep temperature. I will be pouring and the plastic will start to thicken and stop running as I look at my thermoneter in the pot temp is down to about 260 or 280 from 350 wen I started pouring. Also I can't pour 2-pice molds do to the 4" hight of the spout.

I've heard with the Lee pots that you have to take the base off, turn it around and put it on a block and weight it down or screw it into the block to be able to pour the taller molds.

[Chadk]

TJ beat me to it. I bought one of Mikes pots and will vouch for him.

[rusty3]

Basseducer,

Thanks for the help, this sounds great but I don't see the link.

[Delw]

there are 4 screws on the bottom of the lee pot base,
just unscrew them turn the base around and screw them back in.

Then (this is very important) your lee pot will tip, so you must screw it down to raised part of the table.
guys have used bricks phonebooks and other things but it is fail safe if you bolt it down or clamp it.

[Basseducer]

OK, lets try it again.

http://www.tackleunderground.com/forum/soft-plastics/12148-presto-pot-version-2-double-trouble.html

TJ

[Loathar1]

I am interested as soon as any info comes out.

[mradamh]

Yeah, 'd be interested in seeing pics and prices on something like this. I spoke with a guy last week trying to move a 6 station machine for $9500. Great deal actually, considering it's a 25k machine, but it was just out of my businesses price range at the moment.

[Delw]

I wont make these, I'll make parts for them and help guys that need it.
I leave the machines to zorn molds.

Well unless someone actually wanted to drop the money on it and was serious about it ;). it takes alot of time and quite a bit of money to design and make a machine for soft platics.

[bass100]

I will be more than happy to test your prototypes Del.

[Delw]

HAHA I bet you would be.

Delw